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"Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"

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Carl (Guest) (3 posts) Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-01-02, 10:19 AM (Pacific)
"Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"
In Wizzes 6 & 7, I always enjoyed creating a super-elite party that had tough slogging at first but was unstoppable by the end. My favorite party was 2 ninjas (1 faerie), a lord, a samurai, a monk and a bishop. I imported that party, and am having lots of trouble just getting through the upper monastery. Disease is proving particularly insurmountable. At level 7, none of these characters have yet learned the cure disease spell, and there appears to be no cure disease potions to be found (e.g., Burz doesn't sell them).

Has anyone had similar experiences with this sort of party?

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Strange Brew (Guest) (0 posts) Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-01-02, 10:29 AM (Pacific)
1. "RE: Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"
My very first wiz 8 party was an elite party very similar to yours. I had a saved game just before meeting a group of 7 or 8 pestilent rats in the upper monastery and found them impossible to beat after countless tries. So I started again with a less elite party and found it easier. But the pestilent rats disease attack can be devastating (I assume that is what you are being attacked by). Funnily enough on all of my other parties through the game I never met any pestilent rats until after returning to the monestary later in the game. Maybe the more elite the pary the more difficult enemies are generated? Its probably more of just a coincidence though.
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Avatar (Guest) (0 posts) Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-01-02, 10:50 AM (Pacific)
2. "RE: Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"
Yup, only didderence between your party and mine is that instead of a bishop I had a bard. Best way to cope with this is in fighting and marching use melee formation (no front, no back, just sides and middle) Also be advised that "elite" (bishop does not qualify as "elire") do not syaty gaining spell abilities until level 5 and you have a definite weakness here. Pure parties are a "plus" in wiz 8 early going. About level 10 elite starts to come in to it's own.
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Dyak (Guest) (127 posts) Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-01-02, 11:58 AM (Pacific)
3. "RE: Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"
I had a very similar experience, but I think it is about "imported elite parties", not just "elite parties".
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Achila (Guest) (50 posts) Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-01-02, 04:46 PM (Pacific)
4. "RE: Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"
Once your samurai is advanced enough with his/her Alchemy, you can combine a heavy heal potion + cure light condition to give you a cure disease potion. Unfortunately, this won't help you in the monastery now, if your party isn't very advanced, but it will come in handy later.

-=Achila=-

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Strange Brew (Guest) (0 posts) Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-04-02, 09:21 AM (Pacific)
5. "RE: Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"
I thought a samurai learnt mage spells. Ranger and Ninja are the alchemists.
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rbrown (2 posts) Click to EMail rbrown Click to send private message to rbrown Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-04-02, 12:19 PM (Pacific)
6. "By the end of Wiz7, all my parties were elite"
but after reading the boards before buying the game, I realized that they would be crippled. Before a team transferred to Wiz 8, I switched 1 or 2 members to alchemist or bishop or psionic or bard. (I also got bows and slings and practiced hard.) For your first few trips through the game, you need several fast spell learners.

In your case, switch two players to a pure spellcaster class as soon as possible. Or have every elite class practice spells (use the heal wounds spell on every injury) and build up their realm skills. As a desperation move, retransfer and change classes on your 2nd or 3rd levelup.

Are you the Carl that wrote "In defense of fairies" about 3 years ago on this board?

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Carl (Guest) (3 posts) Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-06-02, 04:10 PM (Pacific)
8. "RE: By the end of Wiz7, all my parties were elite"
Ha, what a memory! Yes, that was me.
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rbrown (2 posts) Click to EMail rbrown Click to send private message to rbrown Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-07-02, 12:56 PM (Pacific)
9. "In Praise of Faeries"
In Praise of Faeries

Posted by Carl on February 25, 1999 at 11:20:35:

(debinet.debevoise.com - 208.201.160.2)

In Reply to: oh ... and what is the big deal with the fairy cls
posted by mike harakal on February 25, 1999 at 07:00:49:

1. A faerie ninja equipped with a cane of corpus (which can only be
used by a FN) and a rod of sprites (which can only be used by
faeries)is the deadliest fighter in the game, bar none. Not only
does the cane/rod combination do more damage per hit than any other
(even lightsword/wakizashi+1), but faeries, because of their high
dexterity and speed, get more hits per strike and more strikes per
round than other races. Thus equipped, a FN will usually kill 4
monsters per round.

2. Faeries have a natural AC 2 points lower (i.e., better)than other
races. Not only are our faerie ninjas the hardest hitters in the
game, they (with faerie monks) have the best defenses. A NAKED
fully-trained faerie ninja or monk has a natural AC of -14, with
body ACs of -14. Equipped with faerie-usable items and armor, she
can have a natural AC of -19 and body ACs as low as -31. By
contrast, the BEST AC a fully-trained non-faerie lord can have,
using the best armor in the game, is a natural AC of +4 and body ACs
of -10.

3. As implied by the preceding paragraphs, faerie ninjas are
comparatively low-cost. They don't require all the incredibly
hard-to-find armor that lords, valkyries and samurais do, yet have
much better defenses. And their weapons are easier to find -- unlike
Excaliber or murumasa blades, you don't have to get lucky (or reload
for hours) to find canes -- you just have to be able to kill
Bleinmeis! Since one of the difficulties in the game is the limited
number of chests with high-end weapons and armor, having faerie
ninjas means the high-end stuff can be spread among fewer other
characters.

4. Faeries have the highest natural speed, dexterity and
intelligence, and the second-highest personality,in the game. These
natural abilities appear to transcend stats -- given 6 characters
each of whom has 20 speed and dexterity and 18 intelligence and
personality, your faeries will always go first in combat, be more
adept at opening locks and chests, fizzle fewer spells, and
negotiate better with NPCs. Their speed is is a huge advantage when
fighting speedy characters such as Bleinmeis or the Fiend of 9
worlds. Because of their intelligence, they make great
spell-casters.

5. Weaknesses: (a) Terrible strength. This counsels against relying
on faeries to be great fighters, except as cane-wielding ninjas.
Carrying capacity isn't a big issue, since they can't wear (and
don't need) heavy armor anyway, and most of the puzzle items in the
game aren't heavy. (b) Bad piety. This causes them to develop slower
than, say, elves, since they tend to get fewer skill points per
level. However, this deficiency can be minimized by saving right
before they level and replaying the level until you get good points.
(c) Bad vitality. This gives them fewer hit points than other races.
However, as we've seen, they're much less likely to be hit. Besides,
as the game progresses, characters are more likely to die from
critical hits or spells than from loss of hit points.

Conclusion: Because (as we've been discussing) it's possible to get
2 canes, it follows that the most powerful possible party has 2
faerie ninjas. This solves the problem of equipping your 3
front-rank fighters, since the third can carry the 1-handed Light
Sword plus a Wakazashi+1 (if a ninja or samurai) or a Diamond Eyes
(if a lord or valkyrie). Otherwise, you usually wind up with a lord
swinging Excaliber (which, although 2-handed, is no better than the
Light Sword) or a Samurai with a murusama (which is not quite as
good as the Light Sword, plus Samurai's defenses aren't that good).
I also like to have a faerie spell-caster -- either a bishop or
(more recently) a monk who started out as a bishop and casts all the
bishop spells.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Follow Ups:

* Re: In Praise of Faeries Scone - 11:38:12 3/01/99 (2)
o Re: In Praise of Faeries Ogre - 11:56:40 3/01/99 (1)
+ Re: In Praise of Faeries Thanks...I'll try it -
04:04:56 3/02/99 (0)
* Jesus Christ on a Popsickle Stick mike h - 16:17:00 2/25/99 (0)
* Holy Winged Crusader - That was AWESOME! (nt) Ogre - 11:32:40
2/25/99 (0)

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Bela (2 posts) Click to EMail Bela Click to send private message to Bela Click to view user profile Click to check IP address of the poster
Mar-05-02, 10:56 PM (Pacific)
7. "RE: Wiz 8 - Not Kind to Elite Parties?"
Creatures in the Monastary that can disease you only appear once you reach level 5 or 6. Simply don't increase your level past that until you are ready to leave.
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