Some semi-rambling thoughts about the classes, which hopefully will encourage others to contribute their opinions...

Fighting classes:

Fighter: Whew, they can dish out the damage. The stamina regen is very nice early on, but doesn't seem to be as useful later. One good feature: you can focus on only 4 stats (Str, Vit, Dex, Spd) unless you plan to switch. I switched my fighter to a lord at 9th level, and I think that was a mistake in some ways, altho the lord's HP regen is better IMO than the fighter's stamina regen.

Class switching notes: The best switches I can think of, would be to samurai or ninja. NOT for the magic, but for crits.

Lord, Valk: Might be tough going initially, but if you start the game with one of these, you probably can live without a dedicated priest in the party. Magic Screen and Armorplate are long-duration spells, but you cast them so much anyway that you improve your skills in those areas fairly quickly.

Samurai: My Felpurr has been the weakest of my fighters, but that's beginning to change. One problem with samurai is that they really want to improve *6* different stats (everything but Piety), and this is just hard to do. But, as the Int and Senses have been creeping up, I'm starting to see more crits out of my samurai. Magically, they're slower...more combat spells, but they're coming late and are useful in some circumstances, but more often, you need to use a more effective attack mode. That means less practice, and therefore slower development.

Monk, Ninja: The only example I have here is RFS-81, and a little time spent with my first party (only reached 9th level, was getting extremely frustrated and decided to restart). I *like* monks. Martial arts skill develops fast...lots of attacks. Nice to have someone on Psionic spellbook too, which is somewhat hard to get otherwise. Ninjas share many of the same benefits, and toss in thieving...but may tend to be skill point hogs, as thieving is a skill where you don't get that much practice.

Ranger: Auto-searching, and the search skill, are godsends initially, especially for me without my old Wiz7 parties to import. Great rearguard character, obviously, standing back with the bow. Since ranged combat is the class strength, interestingly, you can do well to NOT push Speed...let him sit back while the fighters wail away on the front-line opposition, then pick off the next rank.

Class switching: I don't see any benefit from switching out of any of these. Your magical skills start late and develop slowly; you'll still be gaining useful abilities for most of the game.

To be continued...

• RE: Class (and class switching) comments,Brother Steven, 09:05 AM, Dec-11-01
  • RE: Class (and class switching) comments,kiwi, 09:21 AM, Dec-11-01
  • RE: Class (and class switching) comments,Brother Steven, 12:12 PM, Dec-11-01
    • RE: Class (and class switching) comments,kiwi, 12:32 PM, Dec-11-01
• RE: Class (and class switching) comments,Tiburon (Guest), 09:12 AM, Dec-11-01

I believe this question will be debated quite often with the new changes to it in wiz 8.

Here are my 2 cents:

Class changing to make super-characters has been pretty much elimnated( you could still do it but plan on playing for a very long time)

Some changes that may be good would be to begin with a pure magic character, and gain a few levels with this character say maybe 10 levels, then switch to one of the hybrid classes that also learns from that spell book.

you will already have 10 levels in that spell book and hopefully around 50-60 points in that magic area, you would then proceed to gain the next four levels without gaining any new magic spells (I am guessing this is the case, I have not put this into practice).

You will gain 8 more levels bring you total to 22. Now you should still be able to use the top level spells, just as if you had started out as the hybrid character. (Since you will have 18 levels in that magic field).

The benefit to doing this is that you will not have to train the skills as much in the later going to inprove them as long as you add the 3 points in at each level up, if you are at 60 at level 10 when you make the switch that is 8*3=24 points you can put into that area, so you only need to train in an extra 6 points over the next 12 levels.

Of course there is no reason why you would have to wait until level 10, you may just want to go around level 1-4 so you can get some spells to work with early on.

Like maybe start as an alchemist, to get heal and sleep, then after the first level up switch to you new class. Then you will have 4 levels of training to do with those spells.

This might be the way to go if you are planning on using all hybrids, start them out in the magic class then make the switch early after you have picked up some heal spells and then go from there.

It just remains now to work out the math to see when this is possible.

Brother Steven

One note, you cannot gain in magic skills, even through practice, if you are a hybrid class with lower then 5 levels in that class. That said, taking one level early on in your respective magic class is a huge boost! My hybrids are getting spells at almost the same rates as my true magic users. My party is as follows:

Lord
Samurai
Ninja
Gadgeteer
Mage
Bishop

When I stared, the Bishop started as a Priest. However, I think that I'd start him as a bishop and switch to a priest at first level up. Anyway, after 4 levels of priest, she became a bishop and hasn't looked back since. The other characters each took a level of their magic class. The ninja at level 2, the lord at level 2, the samurai at level 3. This meant that they got initial points in their spell book skill and realms. In addition, they had one level of total immersion in magic. They then had to wait till they got up to level 5 in their other class... level 6 total... to start really practicing their magic. Now that they are level 10 or so, they are all doing very well. The first round or two of every fight, I just throw a spell or two at the monsters. Then I sit back, cast spells from the rear and hack from the front lines. My Samurai usually starts out casting fireball and freeze flesh. Since he often goes first, this inhibits the enemies right off the bat. I can't wait to start out the fight with two nuclear blasts!!!

If you decide to go pure magic then switch to one the hybrids then you need to be careful and make sure you will be able to switch early on to that hybrid class.

I checked a few cases and a pure magic human ( priest, psionic, mage, alchemist) can change into it's hybrid classes (lord, val, monk, samurai, ranger, ninja) at the first level up if you use the bonus points properly.

The elf is okay for the alchemist, mage and psionic,
but will not work for early changing with the priest.

that is all I really checked,

And also the mook will not work for the priestly change.

Just ran a party through like this, took a few reloads to get to level 2 and I had to use both cherry bombs on the tough crabs at the beginning but they seem to be poised to go now.

Brother Steven

Yeah. I had to be very careful with my character creation. I had a human samurai who had no problem with becoming a mage. My felpurr ninja easily became an alchemist, and my dwarf lord became a priest. My priest needed a few levels of int before she could become a bishop.

Rogue: Gotta love em! An awesome class, IMO. Nudge Artifacts skill, and maybe Throwing skill, a little early, and use those scrolls, powders, and bombs to make up for the lack of spells. Backstabs mean you do as much or more damage than the fighters.

Class switching: So far, I don't see a reason to switch out. That may change, as better weapons show up; I'm currently running with a pair of cursed daggers, which means no swapping out to a bow. We'll see.

Gadgeteer, Bard: Don't have either, considering a bard for replay, once I finish.

Class switching: Can't say...

Spellcasters:

Alchemist: Not tried one yet, but potion mixing would be handy.

Bishop: Not tried one. Should be very effective, though; the general opinion seems to be that the big, expensive offensive spells aren't worth it. Probably a money sink...buying lots of spellbooks...but should be worth it in the end.

Psionicist: Not tried one.

Priest: Healing spells and stamina spells! Like lord/valk, potential for lots of practice, so magical skills improve fast.

Mage: Don't focus so much on damage...the disabling spells work better. Freeze Flesh, and later Freeze All, are simply wonderful spells.

Class switching: IMO, switching a pure caster to a fighting oriented class is the most logical switch in the later stages of the game, once you have your magical skills and spells lists nearly maxed.