I am starting lose patience with the development of my Ninja. As I am progressing in the game & the monsters get stronger (as the rest of my party is), My weaponless ninja is dishing out the same paltry damage (1 to 4 pts of damage). His spellcasting is also very lame. Is it worth being patient with him, or should I make a class change?

• RE: Ninja,Will Bowden (Guest), 12:17 PM, Jun-24-02
  • RE: Ninja,Sphynx (Guest), 01:00 PM, Jun-24-02
  • RE: Ninja,Pinky (Guest), 01:11 PM, Jun-24-02
    • RE: Ninja,Dragon2k, 06:40 PM, Jun-24-02
• RE: Ninja,Jonno (Guest), 08:11 PM, Jun-24-02
  • RE: Ninja,nomad, 04:22 AM, Jun-25-02
• RE: Ninja,Wintersteel (Guest), 10:37 AM, Jun-25-02
  • RE: Ninja,wizwiz (Guest), 02:23 PM, Jun-25-02
    • RE: Ninja,Jonno (Guest), 07:33 PM, Jun-25-02
      • RE: Ninja,wizwiz (Guest), 09:38 PM, Jun-25-02
        • RE: Ninja,scovey (Guest), 12:30 PM, Jun-27-02
          • RE: Ninja,Wizwiz (Guest), 12:47 PM, Jun-27-02
          • RE: Ninja,Jonno (Guest), 11:19 PM, Jul-01-02
            • RE: Ninja,scovey (Guest), 07:21 AM, Jul-02-02
              • RE: Ninja,Griffy (Guest), 00:41 AM, Jul-05-02
                • MONK POWER,Rogan (Guest), 12:15 PM, Jul-05-02
                • RE: Ninja,Wintersteel (Guest), 09:59 PM, Jul-07-02

What level is your ninja at? I've had ninjas that did some killer damage (grin) as they went up levels...

I suggest you focus on the strengths of the class.
The ninja has the unique ability to score critical
hits with thrown weapons. Hence I suggest you make
sure he always has a shuriken in his hands. If you
want a martial artist, use a monk. If you want big
damage, use a fighter. Don't try to make your ninja
in to either one of these - you will be disappointed.
The ninja is a subtle, multi-talented class.
Unfortunately, you have to specialize at this game
to be successful. Concentrate on the advantages
each class brings to your party and you will do fine.

My ninja is a 6th level right now. I have him using a sling, which may be the problem. I will take the advise of the other post and try him with Shruken, darts, and other thrown weapons

Thrown criticals are for shurkens and other thrown weapons
Slings don't count, bows don't either, guns also don't count
wit those, your stuck with the ammo, if the ammo has a 5% critical chance, and your critical strike skill is 125, level 25, critical chance is only 5%

The ninja like most elite classes takes longer to develop and it is not until higher levels that the Ninja comes into their own.

You need to decide what you want to use your Ninja for.

I personally find the Ninja makes a gun thief and ranged fighter.
The thrown criticals plus his alchemy spells makes him handy on the back lines and having a thiefs ability is a bonus. The naturally improving armour class is a bonus as well.

Later in the game with the Bushido Blade the Ninja aint bad up on front lines either (when his armour class makes that possible).

You need to be more conscious of "training" with a Ninja than you do some other classes. By that I mean let him pick every lock until his skill goes up, try to pickpocket as often as possible (save first in the early stages). When magic becomes available train there as well. Keep him equipped with darts or rocks and sling to improve that skill and give him a cheap sword and a dagger to duel wield as well.

By being so disciplined by around level 15 your Ninja will start to add some kick arse power to the party.

the two times i used a ninja, i had them use slings in the early part of the game. this helped raise their throwing & sling skill without useing up any of the precious shirken or darts. i horded all of them i could, bought out every shop that had them every time i went there and stashed them. like jonno said, sometime around level 13 - 14 their throwing skill was high enough to let them start using those shirken and darts and they were getting a goodly number of critical hits.

all of the hybrids( including bishop ) require much more thought and management then the non-hybrid classes.

If I may add my two cents, Pinky... I've said in other posts that a ninja's race has a lot to do with what you are trying to do with him/her. I favor faerie ninjas, just to get the Cane of Corpus (this is something that goes back to Wiz 7, so if you havent played it, don't worry). Faeries will max out speed if you raise it every level, but strenght sucks. Always give them weapons, and don't forget that potions and powders can count towards the trown weapon skill. Misc. items that affect Senses, Speed or Dexterity will affect your critical hit ability. Don't ever neglect Strenght, even if the character class description doesn't emphisise it. Start training them in spell use, particularlly Air, to get the Portal spells. Ninjas, monks and samuri, regardless of race, need to have as high a Sense skill as possible, since this determines initiative and critical hit chance. My faerie ninja makes a good set up man for my other characters, as the CoC usually causes poison damage and paralyzation, and almost as often, critical hits. Good luck with your development.

Personally I think wiz 8 setup where it is much easier to specialize. My party has 2 Fighters, 1 Samuri, 1 Mage, 1 Bishop, 1 Preist. I made all these classes good at only one thing. By completely specializing each class you get an unstopable party. I have spent no points on majic for my Samuri (similar to a Ninja) therefor he is a great fighter with high HP. This is my second time through and the first time I relized half way through the game the first time that my Samuri would never be a great spell caster until about level 25 (by that I mean it would be more worth while for him to attack and have a 5% kill rate and deal 150-200+ damage in one turn. SPECIALIZE!!!

Wiz Wiz if you are not going to take advantage of a Ninja's and even more so a Samurais magic power then there is reduced incentive to have them. They are basically a fighter then (although the Ninja can have a thiefs skill.) The best fighter in the game is strangely enough a Fighter. A level 20 Fighter in melee mode can consistently do several hundred hit points damage a round with a good polearm. A Ninja (Cane of Corpus aside) or Sumarai cannot touch that. Add to thatthe fighters abilities of the knock out plus stamina regeneration and they are way ahead on a pure fighting ability comparison. Say nothing of ease of finding armour, weapons, hitpoints etc.

A properly developed Samurai and Ninja can get that deficit back by having reasonable magic power by level 20. Iceball, firebomb etc make great long range weapons. The fighter can only peel off a few arrows or sling a couple of rocks in comparison.

Balanced and considered development of the elite classes is the key.

Your wrong. A Samuri is just as potent as a Fighter. One of my fighters has 681 kills, because he has had the Bloodlust the entire game. My other fighter is equiped with the Fang and has 353 kills. My Samuri who has had the handicap of not having the Enchanted Wak. and Bushido Blade (I found them much later in the game than I could have) has 308 kills. If I was to give him the Bloodlust he would have had just as many kills as one of my fighters because Samuri's have the CRITCLE HIT skill. Fighter do not. That makes them equally potent fighters if you put all your skill point into phisical combat. The Samuri does suffer from lower HP and Stamina but that can be solved with the right armor. BUT IT PURE FIGHTING SKILL THEY CAN BE EQUAL.

>Your wrong. A Samuri is
>just as potent as a
>Fighter. One of my
>fighters has 681 kills, because
>he has had the Bloodlust
>the entire game. My
>other fighter is equiped with
>the Fang and has 353
>kills. My Samuri who
>has had the handicap of
>not having the Enchanted Wak.
>and Bushido Blade (I found
>them much later in the
>game than I could have)
>has 308 kills. If I
>was to give him the
>Bloodlust he would have had
>just as many kills as
>one of my fighters because
>Samuri's have the CRITCLE HIT
>skill. Fighter do not.
> That makes them equally
>potent fighters if you put
>all your skill point into
>phisical combat. The Samuri
>does suffer from lower HP
>and Stamina but that can
>be solved with the right
>armor. BUT IT PURE
>FIGHTING SKILL THEY CAN BE
>EQUAL.

If you are looking at kill stats alone to determine who is the stronger character, then a Mage would be right up there with the fighter.

Also, I would not credit a kill if all he did was get in the last hit.

Using a trainer, I did the following test. Both the Fighter and Samurai were using a plain old long sword. With the same weapon skill and stats in strength and dexterity, the fighter consistently hit for more damage. Only 2 times did the Samurai hit for more and that was because he got in a Lightning Strike those 2 times.

All things being equal, the fighter is the better of the 2.
Test it for yourself.

Spence

good job lets all get a life

I know WiZ Wiz won't be happy, but it even states in the manual that a fighter is the best fighter..........

Having completed the game twice, I found a party of 3 fighters, a ranger, a bard and a bishop to be unstoppable. I hardly suffered a character fatality all game, let alone a party failure.

When I had an elite party of sumarai, ninja, monk, lord, sumarai, valkyrie and ranger I suffered scores of character fatalities, and several party failures.

Fighters just basically demolish everything in there path. They are the tanks of Wiz 8, just as Ninj's were tanks in Wiz7.

To tell you the truth, I was hoping that WizWiz was correct. I would much rather have a Samurai over a fighter if they were indeed the same, melee wise.

The one time I did use a Samurai, I changed him to a fighter after learning the Portal spell. I would have kept him a Samurai but I needed more damage with my hits. You can't just count on the critical hits to make up for this. They're nice and all but you just don't get enough of them. Where as you can always count on the fighter for massive damage every time he scores a hit.

The Samurai makes up for this with it's magic ability. In a lot of cases this is better than a fighter. I'd much rather web or freeze the enemies, then walk up to them, before hitting them as opposed to letting them get within reach of my Fighter.

Spence

I don't find the Samurai all that hot either. I would much sooner take a valkerie with a polearm, they just seem to do more damage. The Ninja does not impress me much either. I'm about level 16 with everybody now and he's just not doing much damage.
The Ranger is another class I question. I'm not sure how much ranged criticals he does but it's not that much.
I usually stay away from fighters in these games and I'm on my second party now and have not finished once. I don't really care about winning, I really prefer the journey. I might just brake down and what a few fighters can do.

Hi everyone,

I know thats somewhat outta the post theme here. I have been posting my progress as a DWARF MONK Male character SOLOING the game. I would really like to read your opinions on my quest to suceed.

Greater (and all) details about my progress are in the topics "SOLOing with a DWARF MONK Male". Please share your thoughts. I must say I am profoundly happy to see that this wonderful game, Wizardry 8, is still very much alive even as Morrowind and Neverwinter Nights are around - and I own both of these great games, still, I simply canīt stop playing Wizardry 8 for more than some days.

Good weekend for everyone!

I've already posted my thoughts on the faerie ninja, so let me say that if you want to try a fighter, go lizardman. They can max out vitality by lvl 5 and strength by lvl 6-7. The only other race/class combo that would max out two stats that fast would be a faerie spell slinger maxing either intelligence, piety or speed (2 out of the 3).